BPCCRA Minutes October 13th 2010





  • Terry Stewart President
  • John Sprackling Chairman
  • Wayne Hancock Vice-chairman
  • Keith Alcroft Data Protection Officer
  • Stan Alfert Magazine Advertising
  • Cllr Mrs Carole Deas
  • Cllr Mrs May Haines
  • Cllr Neil Sorton

Approx 15 Members/Wardens

TS & CD left at 8.10pm to attend a specially arranged consultation meeting at St James Church Hall, Poole about the “Between the Bridges” development in West Quay Road,


JS welcomed the three Ward Councillors and all those present.

Apologies: Apologies received from Bob & Phyllis Young and Hazel Clifton

Accuracy: JS said that he would sign the Minutes as a true and accurate record of the meeting held on 08 SEPTEMBER 2010.

2. MATTERS ARISING Poole Pottery/Old Orchard/Quay Thistle Hotel sites update: JS reported…           

1.            Quayside (former Dolphin Quays) development – No new developments

2.            Poole Pottery factory buildings in Sopers Lane – A planning application for an 80 bed care home with associated facilities was registered on 09/09/10.

3.            Former Poole Pottery & Swan Inn site – No new developments

4.            Quay Thistle Hotel site – ditto

5.            Old Orchard House. 39-61 High Street – ditto

6. Land at West Quay Road (Mixed use regeneration and new public quayside to include;

the demolition of a listed gate post and all existing buildings on site; the redevelopment of the site with 440 residential units provided in six apartment blocks with basement parking and courtyard

Planning Enforcement, TPOs/Tree replacements update:

JS reported…

17 Over Links Drive (Application to demolish existing and erect 2 detached houses granted on 31/01/08 but number of conditions should have been complied with before this development commenced) – No new developments but ground work continuing.

19 Mornish Road (Tree replacement) – ditto

55 Canford Cliffs Road (Removal of the gates, railings, fence and hedge, and the erection of a low stone wall with planting behind) – ditto

15A Westminster Road (Erection of railings over 1 metre high partly along the frontage of 15a Westminster Road, being adjacent to a highway. The boundary treatment then changes to a double close boarded fence over 1 metre high which continues along the frontage of Westminster Road, being adjacent to a highway and then turns South-West and continues down the boundary with Dalkeith Road being also adjacent to a highway) ditto

2 Compton Avenue & 93 Lilliput Road (Boundary treatment) – ditto

Community Working Group (CWG): Roy Pointer reported on CWG meeting held on 22/09/10 and said that the Minutes of the meeting would be circulated with the Minutes of tonight”s meeting.

RP reported that the Members” Annual Tour of Inspection, which was due to take place last month, will now take place on 09/11/10. The tour is part of the member training programme, as well as an opportunity to review the quality of recent development and the success, or otherwise of place shaping. Five CWG members have been invited to join the Tour and RP has put his name down for this.

JS pointed out that the Tour of inspection is concerned with large sites and he did not feel that Members would have time to visit small sites in our area.

However, Cllr Mrs Haines said that she had recently had reason to visit 29 Forest Road (13 houses with associated parking) and felt the development did actually look attractive. This was a sub-division of a large plot and Cllr Mrs Haines suggested that this particular site could be put forward as a site to be visited by the Tour of Inspection to see if a development such as this works.

Poole Beaches and Coastal Defences: RP said the the issue of flood defences is due to be  discussed at the next CWG meeting.

Council Tax 2010/11 & Council”s Budget Monitoring report: TS reported on the Financial workshop held on 24/09/10 as part of the consultation on the Council”s 2011/12 Budget.

Six members of the Association attended along with 14 others to review the proposed cuts of £29m over the next four years from the Council’s annual budget of £100m. Each participant was given a list of the costs for each department. These amounts varied considerably, from ‘Adult Social Services’ which is 39% of the total budget to ‘Parks’ which is only 1%. Those attending were asked to try to cut the budget in each section by various percentages. TS said that those attending found this well-nigh impossible as they did not have sufficient information as to the breakdown of the budgets.

Everyone from the Association who attended decided that even though they had some good discussions the whole thing was just a PR exercise to demonstrate how painful these cuts were going to be.

TS has since received an e-mail from Cllr Peter Adams asking for his suggestion as to what the next meeting might consist of.  TS will reply that those attending need more detail so that they know in practice what each cut will mean.

There then followed many comments and much discussion on the Council budget; mainly between the members of this Association who had attended the Workshop.

Chairman”s Note: The formal notes of the meeting will be circulated the Minutes of tonight”s meeting.

As TS had to leave the meeting early to attend, he used this opportunity to give feedback on his attendance earlier today at the first in a series of Twin Sails Bridge/Regeneration Open Days

He reported that the exhibition really brought home to him just how massive the changes are going to be to the centre of Poole.  He is worried that there does not seem to be a clear design or masterplan and each developer will develop how he wants to, or how much he can get away with to maximise their profits.  There is so much concern about this that a new Committee has been formed ‘The Vision for Poole Committee consisting of The Society for Poole Men, the Old Town Conservation Group and Dorset Campaign for the Protection of Rural England. The aim of this committee is to ask for tighter guidance and control of these ten sites. TS said that, in his opinion, Members need to stand up and be counted and really take a grip as the situation which, in his view, seems to be out of control.

Chairman”s Note: TS report on the information gained at today”s Twin Sails Bridge/Regeneration Open Day at Hamworthy Library is set out at the foot of these Minutes.

Poole Partnership: JS reported that the joint meeting of Poole and Bournemouth Vision Groups which was due to take place on Monday 5th October has been postponed until after the Comprehensive Spending Review.

The Poole Partnership Local Development Framework Working Group meeting which was fixed for yesterday was also cancelled.

Public Rights of Way:

Westminster Road end of Dalkeith Road – No new developments.

Buccleuch Road to Lakeside Road – ditto

Bessborough Road – ditto

Footpath 82 Spur – Sandbanks Boatyard & Marina Co. Ltd has until 21/10/10 to appeal against the Definitive Modification Order to add Footpath 82 Spur.

Chairman”s Note: The deadline for objections appears to have been extended to 25/11/10.

Possible Charitable Status for Assn: JS has still to set up a small Sub-Committee to look at this.

Canford Cliffs Play Area/Pinecliff Gardens (Sunken garden):

Cllr Mrs Deas said that she had spoken with Simon Legg, BoP Greenspace Maintenance Team Leader, yesterday and the process is well underway. He hopes that the takeover of the garden will be pretty soon and he is drawing up details to the BPCCRA for their agreement and approval of the necessary documents needed to be signed by the Association, i.e. insurance, peppercorn rent etc.

Cllr Mrs Deas also reported on her support for Affordable Housing. She has been pushing for the Council to adopt the procedure of Kingston-upon-Thames. For instance, on contentious issues, the council do not go ahead and give approval without seeking the views of the residents.

She has so far had little success in this and asks that the Resident’s Associations should press as hard as they can to get this implemented.

Cllr Mrs Deas went on to say that she had attended a Planning Summer School some years ago where it was demonstrated that it is possible to regenerate the centre of a town sympathetically by incorporating modern architecture alongside old architect extremely successfully which she feels should be done in Poole centre.

JS pointed out that when Gallahers are ready to come forward with fresh plans for the former Power Station site, he feels sure that these will be the subject of a Local Engagement Forum.

Chairman”s note: The purpose of the Local Engagement Forum is “to enable those members of the community who might have meaningful comments to make on a major development, to have the opportunity to listen to detailed discussions and participate in the shaping of the scheme before it is submitted to the Council for a decision, as part of the Planning process.”

Policy for financially supporting objectors to Planning Applications:

JS read the proposals put together by Roy Pointer and SA, which were distributed to members at the meeting. These were:

1. Delegated authority is given for a Sub-group, following the request of any member, to engage specialists to draft formal representations in respect of Planning Applications which the Sub- group considers would:

(a) if approved, involve a substantial departure from the intent of national or local planning policy or regulations, and/or

(b) set an undesirable precedent for future development in the area covered by the Association.

2. The Sub-group has no authority to act in regard to Applications that relate to development outside the Association’s area nor on any request from any Member that objection be made to any Application which objection is, in the Sub-group’s opinion, largely made on a subjective basis, e.g. a mere dislike of the proposal. Any representations shall be based on planning considerations alone.

3. The Sub-group shall have no authority to arrange representations in respect of any planning appeal. The Sub-group shall comprise:

The Chairman of the Association

The Planning Officer of the Association

One other Member

Delegation to commit funds

4. The Sub-group may commit up to £1,000 or 50% (whichever is the lower) of the total cost of specialist services in respect of a single representation providing the sum committed is a full and final cost of the service up to the point of submitting the representation and not an initial instalment against further or unspecified costs of representation in respect of the Application.

5. The Sub-group shall report to the next regular meeting of the Association, any action taken under this delegation and, if necessary, seek guidance from the Association on any further action.


6. The application of this delegation arrangement shall be reviewed by a Committee of the Association after the commitment of a total of £5,000 of funding, or two years operation of this Delegation, whichever shall first occur.

The Chairman then asked the meeting for comments.

Chris Stracey said that a residence had been built in his road that resembles ‘a white shoe box’, completely unlike anything else in the road, even though many objections were raised at the time.

The Chairman cited two fairly recent cases. That at 11 Leicester Road (Outline application to demolish existing dwelling & erect a 59 bedroom care home (class C2) with associated parking (15 spaces) for which the professional representation was funded by the neighbour, and Kingsgate, 7 The Avenue for which the Association contributed £1,000 towards the £11,000 it had cost for professional representation.

The above proposals are meant to help objections where an awful precedent would be set were the developing plans allowed, and not for smaller instances, for which KA provides the wording for an objection letter to the Council from the Association.

TS pointed out that the principle of this is that the Association contributes towards professional advice to fight a local contentious issue whereby a number of residents would be affected, or where it would set an undesirable precedent.

Cllr. Mrs Deas said that Kingsgate, 7 The Avenue, was a good example. Mr. & Mrs. Lace have just received notification from Barrister’s opinion that they can actually stop anyone accessing the  driveway. The Council were arguing against this and backing Seven Developments but through Barrister’s Opinion the residents have discovered that they do in fact own four-fifths of the driveway and they are entitled to withhold right of way. This will send out a clear message to Seven Development that residents will fight to the end, even if Council have already given their planning permission.

KA pointed out that it is very difficult to legislate to cover all situations. SA proposed that we accept the proposals as they stand now.

The Chairman asked for a show of hands that these proposals be adopted with a note to cover KAs point.

Public Liability Insurance (PLI) – JS is pursuing.

Poole Council”s Business Transformation/Efficiency Review Programme: An updated report on this programme is due to be presented to the Council Efficiency and Effectiveness Overview and Scrutiny Committee meeting in February 2011.

Funding for the NHS Dental Practice in Westbourne: JS reported that Mr Hamid Kolahy of the Westbourne Dental Practice had recently written to Jim Wilson to say that his practice n Alum Chine Road is only paid at £19.50 per UDA compared with three other local dental practices are paid at a higher rate Alderney Dental Practice, 451 Ringwood Road £26.00 per UDA (3.1 miles) Pasadena Dental, 210 Ashley Road, Parkstone £24.50 per UDA (1.6 miles) Parsa Dental, 11 The Triangle, Bournemouth £24.00 per UDA (1.1 miles)

JS ascertained that none of those present at the meeting actually use the Westbourne Dental Practice and it was decided that the Association took no action to follow this u, especially as it is outside our own area.

Chairman”s note: In a note from Sarah, the Director of Patient Safety and Quality, NHS Bournemouth and Poole to Jim Wilson dated 19/07/10, she says that it is “not in a position to reimburse all dentists to the highest level of payment and due to the contractual position of dentists; it would not be possible to remove resources from another dentist. However, when Units of Dental Activity become available, for example if a dental practice closes, the PCT will put the activity out to tender with a view to securing a dental service in line with our Oral Health Needs Assessment. In this way, dentists can secure additional activity and we will at the same time review the value of the UDAs.”

BPCCRA Autumn 2010 Magazine: JS signed off final version on 11/10/10.

SA reported that the lists of wardens had now been printed and those who distribute the magazines should be getting their printed lists from Michael Bond within the next couple of weeks. SA appealed to Wardens to let him know where the data is wrong, so that the Assn can

maintain the best possible database.

Parking in Shore Road: Cllr Mrs Haines reported that she was due to present a petition from residents living in Shore Road and Brudenell Avenue, about camper vans being used as “beach- huts” & overnight sleeping and water sports vans parking 24/7 in Shore Road by taking advantage of Beach Parking Permits, to the Transportation Advisory Group meeting on 07/10/10 but this was cancelled and the next meeting will take place on 25/11/10

As Cllr Mrs Haines will not be here for this meeting the petition will be presented by Cllr. Sorton. Another Ward Councillor will also be at this meeting as other areas in the Borough also have similar problems with camper vans.

3. NEW HOUSING DEVELOPMENT JS reported that the Assn had not registered any objections to planning applications during the past month.

Other current planning issues

The Cottage, Kingsgate, 7 The Avenue (Erect a detached house on land adjacent to The Cottage and erect detached garage to The Cottage) – Application was granted with conditions at Planning Committee meeting on 09/09/10.

4 Lawrence Drive (Demolish existing buildings and erect 1 block of 8 apartments with assoc parking) – Application refused on 05/03/10. Awaiting outcome of appeal Hearing (APP/Q1255/A/10/2128771) held on 28/09/10.

11 Westminster Road East

(a) Demolish existing and erect a 3 storey single dwelling and garage with associated vehicular access

(b) Demolition of existing dwelling and garage. Erection of a 3-storey (part) single family dwelling, a garage and associated vehicular access and landscaping

Both applications refused under delegated authority on 04/04/10 & 29/06/10 are subject of a “Written Representations” appeals (APP/Q1255/E/10/2132669 & APP/Q1255/E/10/2132672). The “Start date” for these appeals was 22/07/10. Site visit took place on 13/10/10.

Land adj 1 Over Links Drive (Sever land and erect a new detached house (Revised Scheme) – Application refused by Planning Committee on 10/12/09 is subject of a “Written Representations” appeal (APP/Q1255/A/10/2120940). The “Start date” for this appeal was 27/01/10. Site visit took place on 13/10/10.

11 Westminster Road (Demolition of the existing building and construction of three detached houses with associated parking and access. (revised scheme – Application refused on 17/05/10. Awaiting outcome of appeal Hearing (APP/Q1255/A/10/2129589) held on 12/10/10

24 Ravine Road (Demolish existing dwelling and erect replacement dwelling with integral garaging. (Revised scheme) Amended plans received 08/12/09 and 25/01/10) – Written Representations appeal (APP/Q1255/A/10/2122302) was dismissed on 16/09/10.

2 Crawshaw Road (Demolish existing dwelling and erect x 2 detached dwellings with on-site parking. (Revised Scheme) – Application registered 25/05/10. Amended plans lodged on 14/07/10.

6 Durrant Road

(a) Demolish existing dwelling and erect x2 detached dwellings. (Revised Scheme) As amended by plans received 01/10/09) – Application refused under delegated authority on 11/12/09, now the subject of Written Representations appeals (APP/Q1255/A/10/2121180). Site visit took place on 07/09/10.

(b) Demolish existing dwelling and erect 2 No semi-detached dwellings with attached garages (Revised Scheme)– Application refused by Planning Committee on 08/07/10.

Canford Cliffs, Promenade 2 (a) Construction of 18 new beach huts – Application No: 08/24380/005/F & (b) Conservation Area application to demolish 8 beach huts (nos 99-106) adjacent to Canford Cliffs Chine. Application No: 08/24380/007/U The applications were registered as long ago as 22/01/08 &13/02/08 respectively. MH will keep the Assn advised of any further developments.

4-6 Compton Avenue (Non material amendment of planning permission 06/12687/005/F to extend basement parking, an additional staircase, two roof lights, convert half gable window to full height) Application granted on.26/07/10

8 Shore Road – BPCCRA will continue to monitor possible tree work application. An entrance has been created on the Haven Road side of this property. This property is up for sale at is “offers” in excess of £2m.

60A Kings Avenue (Tree Replacement Notices to replant 3 Scots Pines) – Confirmation awaited that the Council”s Arboriculturist visited both 60 and 60a to check tree issues and that letters sent to the owners requesting planting under Treework/Planning conditions.

4.   UPDATE RE CANFORD CLIFFS & FENN HILL AREA COMMITTEE MEETING (15/09/10) Chairman”s Note: I omitted to cover this item.

Lengthy discussions took place on recent changes in the Penn Hill Avenue and suggestions were made for improvements to the Kingsbridge Road/Highmoor Road junction.

Officers from Strategic Planning gave presentations on Preferred Options for Additional Sites – Consultation on Proposed and Revised Policy Areas

5.                  ACCOUNTS TO DATE – JS reported that the total funds as at 30th September amounted to £33,187.32, which takes account of the £3,000 donated to the Canford Cliffs Village Hall. It has also been agreed to make a payment of £1,000 to the flat-owners at Kingsgate, 7 The Avenue towards their costs of £11,000 fighting Seven Developments applications for the site at the rear.

6.                  ANY OTHER BUSINESS

Ward Walks – Cllr. Sorton reported on his Ward Walk with Cllr. Mrs Haines. Part of this was in Canford Cliffs Village and had suggested that we get rid of some of the clutter’ – in particular some of the litter bins. Cllr. Haines added that the question of trees in Haven Road had been brought up with the officers – trees contained in pots perhaps.

The next area visited was Mountbatten Road/Cassel Avenue area to check the distinctiveness, and will ask for this area to be given Conservation Area status.

Turning circle in Torbay Road – Rose Rogers asked if there were any regulation covering a rubbish skip left permanently obstructing this part of the road Cllr. Mrs Haines said that there was no restriction to having a skip in your own drive. JS suggested that she took up this question with a Penn Hill Ward Councillor, or that she contacts Transportation Services for their advice.

The meeting closed at 8.30pm.

Date of next Meeting: Wednesday 10th November 2010 in the Main Hall at Branksome St Aldhelm”s Parish Centre (Entrance via Lindsay Road)



A. Nigel Jacobs : Strategic Planning

1. I recommend you get hold of the plan and drawings of ‘Poole’s Masterplan. A town Fit for the 21st Century.’

2. Because of cuts & staff shortages they are limited on their work. Current Priorities :

(a) Dorset Heathlands, because of commitments to other Dorset Councils. Nigel leads this project.

(b) Site Specific Plan.

(c) Infrastructure Plan.

(d) Update SPG2 Design Masterplan.

3.They will be starting shortly on updating SPG2.

4.Warren Lever has been asked to look at setting up a Design Forum. Currently the thought is for one covering Bournemouth and Poole. Examples of good forums have some Community participation. Important that one of us is on the Forum.

5.There has been pressure to relax some elements of the SPG2 requirements because of the Recession. The Core Strategy Inspector recommended a more flexible approach to development in the regeneration area to enable development to occur recognising its impact on viability.

6. The Council (i.e. the Councillors if they have the leadership guts my comment) are faced with a choice:

(a) If they want speedier development to provide employment, etc. it will mean lower CIL (Section 106 contributions) for Affordable Housing, and other Infrastructure with less discipline on enforcing SPG2 and other Core Strategy requirements.

Or b) holding up approving the key sites until the economy picks up when the developer profits improve and they can secure contributions to meet the stated needs set out in policy.

7. Planning Department has the power to refuse an application if the architectural design is poor.

8. In the end it is up to Councillors to make this decision. I believe we can apply heavy democratic pressure on Councillors leading up to the Local Elections in May, to apply Option B.

9. CABE have just done a review of the current Masterplan and are relatively happy that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the principles within. Unlikely they will be issuing a written report.

10. The West Quay Road site is a critical to the regeneration of Poole and ideally would come forward last, although the Council has no control over the timing of planning applications. The Council will need to take a view as explained in 6.

11. The Core Strategy statement on number of units per site is a minimum figure. Overall the Core Strategy has to deliver a minimum number of dwellings (PCS5). If developers choose to go for different levels of use then they need to justify against what the overall approach to a site/location is demonstrating that their scheme can meet stated objectives for the Town.

12. He believed that Gallahers would be unlikely to gain support for 1,600 units on Hamworthy site ␣ as compared with Core Strategy 1,100 plus. Anticipates that any future scheme would not be too far away from baseline in Core Strategy.

13. The outline approval for the West Quay Marina site, s106 not yet signed, includes a provision that if the economy picks up and the developer makes more profit than forecast, the Council can re-visit the calculations and secure some Affordable Housing, etc. contributions. This approach is now being worked into other s106 agreements where viability is an issue.

14. Sainsbury are in no hurry to submit an application for development of their car park.

15. There is no indication that the Goods Yard site will be redeveloped soon although Network Rail retains aspirations for a new station but only as part of a development package for the whole site.

16. The multi-storey car park next to the Dolphin Centre may be demolished to allow extension of the centre.

17. The future of the Barclays Tower is uncertain. At some stage Barclays will want modern office accommodation which presents issues over what happens to the current building. Refurbishment is an option but redevelopment probably more likely. Barclays are committed to staying in Poole and there is no timeframe on any changes to this site.

18. The new Lifting Bridge will always be raised first. If there is heavy boat traffic in the summer the Harbour Master will have the power to raise both bridges at the same time should there be safety issues. There will be a bridge control unit on the Gallagher site with views of both bridges.

19. The bus depot behind the multi-storey park will be relocated to an industrial estate to allow expansion of the Dolphin Centre. The Bus Station will not be moved, but it may be re-modelled to allow for the Centre’s expansion.

B. Chris Francombe : Transport Planning

1. A31 link from the Port to Merley, Gravel Hill is unlikely to be dualled in the near future. The A31 round Wimborne may be dualled from 2020, but will depend on Government cuts.

2. Dorset County Council has agreed that the junction at Merley between the A31 and the A 349 will be closed for 2 weeks and 1 day so the 200 VIPs can be guaranteed to travel from London to Weymouth in 2 hours 43 minutes.

There has been no decision yet about the period of the Paralympics. Poole Council were not fully consulted, but are demanding in return that the Canford Bottom roundabout be converted into a hamburger design with the A31 going straight though the middle. Later the roundabout may have a flyover across the middle. There is likely to be traffic chaos during this period.

3. The £40million link from the A338 to the Airport will not be built since there is not a large enough traffic forecast.

4. The industrial site at the Airport is being reduced from 40 hectares to 20. The public bus service will be inadequate. Much employment will be provided at the Ferndown Estate planned for 20 hectares.

5.            Still discussing whether Kingland Road will be closed between the bus station and the Lighthouse. Key is the road into the bus station. Kingland Road may be reduced to a single one- way road.

6.            The rail link to Swanage will be implemented; current cost £40million, but depends on Railtrack problems.

7.            The rubble from the Hamworthy site will be removed over the 2nd lifting bridge and then down Holes Bay Road.

Terry Stewart